My Local Weather
 
December 2009
M T W T F S S
« Nov    
 123456
78910111213
14151617181920
21222324252627
28293031  
We can’t have it both ways

Written on December 16th, 2009
[mood_description] | [music_description]

I recently saw in USA Today this chart showing the tax burden (from all sources) on the citizens of various developed countries:

Denmark           48.3%

Sweden              47.1%

Belgium             44.3%

Italy                   43.2%

France                43.1%

Austria               42.9%

Finland               42.8%

Germany             36.4%

UK                       35.7%

Canada                32.2%

United States   26.9%

Here’s our conundrum:  We want many of the same social programs and safety nets those countries offer their citizens, but we don’t want to pay the taxes they do in order afford those services.  We can’t have it both ways.

Prior to the LBJ years (1964-68) we really didn’t have much of a public welfare system, and our entire national debt was around $311B.  In the 40+ years since we’ve continuously expanded our social safety net, and now we’re looking at some version of universal health care, too.  Not surprisingly, our national debt is now around $11.7T.  That’s TRILLION dollars!  Of course some of that is due to inflation, and it isn’t quite as bad as it sounds due to our now dramatically more robust economy, but still, we’re writing some mighty hot checks.

I’m not saying more taxes in exchange for more services is necessarily a bad thing.  Many of those high-tax countries regularly rate at the very top of the “happy citizen” surveys.  Their citizens have made the conscious decision to trade some of their personal up-side economic potential for more social services/peace of mind.  Fair enough.

So where are we (the US) headed?  I can’t imagine how any politician can look us in the eye and honestly say we can have universal health care, AND a stable Social Security system, AND Medicare for our seniors, etc. WITHOUT raising taxes.

I personally think dramatically higher taxes is where we’re eventually going.  Over the past few years we’ve seen the results of unbridled capitalism where big corporations, special interests, the financial services guys, etc. have shown us that they’re going to get richer, and we’re not.  (Think mega-bonuses FOR them when things go right, and taxpayer bail-outs TO them when things don’t.)  And if “the common man” sees that his upside economic potential is being increasingly restricted, then he’ll probably some day just throw in the towel and go for the social safety net.  Not ALL will, but enough to tip the political scale.

We either must raise our tax burden or give up some of the social programs we have now, and no politician is going to take away the goodies he’s already given us.  That would be political suicide.

You agree, or am I all wet?

S




Comment Number: 3954 . Left by Blackbird on December 16th, 2009 - 11:07 am :

I have never complained about taxes. In fact, I have them take out the maximum amount, and then an extra ten bucks from every pay check. I figure it’s ten bucks I’d blow on something I don’t need, and then in January I get a huge big fat refund check. It’s awesome.






Comment Number: 3955 . Left by lunamor on December 16th, 2009 - 11:15 am :

I think you do have a point.

However, I am already paying a hell of a lot for health care, and to me that may as well be a tax. And don’t tell me about it being tax-deductible - when it comes to bills, only anything after 7% of your income is deductible (I realize that employer-provided insurance comes out before taxes, but that’s different). Because I don’t make a lot, 7% of my income is a HUGE amount to me. So, if I am taxed a couple grand more per year (which is about 7% of my gross income at the moment), but it means my health care is paid for, that evens out - in my world.

I don’t want to get rich. Never have. I want to be comfortable (you might be surprised by little money that can take), and have a healthy family. If my tax burden is higher, but makes that more possible - bring it on.






Comment Number: 3956 . Left by dsl64 on December 16th, 2009 - 11:30 am :

Very mixed feelings about government run health care. Positives for me: not having to work full time anymore to get company group insurance/bennies anymore. I agree with Luna, the big chunk they take out for premiums is like a big tax. I have lost $200-$400 a month in take home pay just this year due to insurance hikes. The negatives for me: Rationed care, it’s already started with some government agency now recommending waiting till age 50 for women to have mammograms. There’s a helluva lot of women who get breast cancer before age 50 who would die because they didn’t get the early detection. More to come, I’m afraid.






Comment Number: 3957 . Left by Tcbntx on December 16th, 2009 - 11:42 am :

Scott, surely you remember the Carter years. I was in the finance business and delinquency was outrageous. Interest rates were in the 20’s. Gas increased over a dollar per gallon due to OPEC, and every thing else increased in price. By 1980 when I had entered the computer business I paid as high as 75% of the money I made in taxes leaving me to struggle because of the taxes and high cost of everyting. No One was investing in business and the economy sucked. My taxes were cut to 37% as were corpoate taxes, small businesses were able to expand, employment increased, interest rates reduced.

I’m sorry my friend but it is not my duty to support the programs that support those that do not want to work, or those here illegally that live off the system.

Our country has continued to decline since LBJ’s Great Society. More and more socialistic countries are reducing their social programs because you cannot tax the upper 5 % of the population to support the 95% that pay the least in taxes. Look at what LBJ’s programs created. A father figureless class that live to bat the system. No motive to even try to contribute thereby lessening the tax base and adding an additional burden to small business and the more affluent tax base. We will become a nation that is 3rd rate if we continue on the path we are now on.






Comment Number: 3958 . Left by thecerebralgarage on December 16th, 2009 - 12:16 pm :

I gotta go with TCB on this one. Sorry Scott,but I think you need a towel.






Comment Number: 3959 . Left by lunamor on December 16th, 2009 - 12:29 pm :

Re: rationed care: it’s already here, D. My mammogram place recommended I get a screening MRI because of family history - did I get it? No. Why? Well, my insurance would cover it, but my deductible is $1000. Do I have an extra $1000 lying around to get a screening test when I have no other risk factors? Nope, I don’t.

Rationing for medical care already exists. And in some ways, it should.






Comment Number: 3960 . Left by Steve on December 16th, 2009 - 12:30 pm :

Statistically speaking, the higher your tax burden, the hotter your women are. I think that’s a chance I’m willing to take.






Comment Number: 3961 . Left by dsl64 on December 16th, 2009 - 2:07 pm :

HMOs, the Sequel. That is what it will be like. Of course back in my 20s and 30s, I loved the HMOs because I wasn’t chronically ill.






Comment Number: 3962 . Left by Lowandslow on December 16th, 2009 - 3:04 pm :

Hold on, guys. I didn’t say I was FOR higher taxes and more social services, I said I thought that was the way many would eventually vote to go. All it takes are 50.00001%, and I think we’re getting closer to that number by the day.






Comment Number: 3963 . Left by Fin on December 16th, 2009 - 5:56 pm :

Doubt whether the US percent of tax includes homeowners. My taxes are closer to half my income.






Comment Number: 3964 . Left by Ros on December 16th, 2009 - 8:39 pm :

Not everyone who would like to see better health care in this country is a deadbeat. When I think of what I have gotten for all of the money I have spent over the years for health care and gotten little or nothing. Then you are right I am for something else. Bring on government health care. After all that is what I will have in a few more months anyway, and I am looking forward to it. I have spent a bundle taking care of everyone else over the years. Now it is my turn. Just take care of this thing on my leg and I will be happy.






Comment Number: 3965 . Left by lunamor on December 17th, 2009 - 11:15 am :

“Of course back in my 20s and 30s, I loved the HMOs because I wasn’t chronically ill.” I’m not really sure what that’s about. I have a chronically ill son, who has insurance - a PPO - and the costs are still horrible and he still has to wait to be seen by doctors. Believe me, I am well versed in the medical system due to this kid, and maybe it’s just New Mexico, but having insurance, and everything being private doesn’t automatically make things better.






Welcome

Live Well, Laugh Often, Love Much

My Poll

Which world leader do you admire the most?


Barack Obama
Ronald McDonald
Pooty Poo Putin
Carla Sarkozy's hubby
Lowandslow
That guy at the UN

You must be logged in to vote!